1. Got a question or need help troubleshooting? Post to the troubleshooting forum or Search the forums!

Have I missed any modifications to my Robo R1+?

Discussion in 'Show and Tell' started by Bil Forshey, Mar 12, 2016.

  1. Bil Forshey

    Bil Forshey Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2015
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    19
    My Robo 3D printer has been modified so many times I am losing track of them all, so I thought I would list them here before I forget. and to let others know about modifications that can be done.

    I started with the R1+ with the heated bed so I could use both PLA And ABS filaments.

    My first upgrade was a set of Z axis stabilizer brackets from Thingiverse printed in Blue ABS filament.

    Next was a set of spool holder brackets designed in BobCad that mounted on the top of the printer.

    Robo 3D offered an upgrade to the original Y axis slide rails with smooth rods, linear bearings and a easily removable heated bed, so I ordered and installed that.

    I didn't want to tie up my computer while printing, so I ordered a Smart LCD controller XXL from Printed Solid and designed and printed a custom enclosure for it that mounted to the side of the printer. I now save my gcode to a 4Gb SD card, and print standalone.

    Robo 3D offered the auto leveling upgrade kit with new Z axis limit switches, ordered and installed, and upgraded firmware.

    My original plastic hot end clogged so bad that I had to replace it. Decided to order an E3D V6 kit from Printed Solid and Installed that.

    Nozzle clogged real bad, ordered and replaced it with new one,along with the hot end thermistor with a new screw in type from Printed Solid.

    Robo 3D offered an upgrade to new Z axis lead screws to reduce ribbing, ordered and installed them.

    The original hobbed bolt was tearing up the filament, ordered an improved replacement on ebay and installed that and replaced extruder screws, springs, with hinged standoffs to make filament changes easier.

    Changed spool holder to use an stainless steel adjustable arm that was salvaged from a computer mounting arm from an old wheelchair.

    Installed an LED light strip inside the top of the printer.

    Installed ferrite bead chokes on the cables to all stepper motors, heaters, power supply, and ribbon cables to the LCD, it eliminated the occasional scrambling of data on the LCD screen.

    Fabricated an aluminum front cover with the R1+ logo for the extruder to help with wire management on the X axis and improve it's appearance.

    Added 3 extra magnets to the Y axis bed supports to improve the stability of the bed. there were 2 on the front and 1 in the back, now there are 3 on both ends and the bed doesn't wobble when leveling.

    Found a Kickstarter campaign for FLEKS3D for an improved build plate, I backed the project and received the reward, installed the build plate system, and it works fantastic, no more hairspray, no more putty knives, no more parts warping off the bed during printing, just flex it to remove the part.
    available from http://www.fleks3d.com

    Designed and printed a filament colorizer using Sharpie chisel tip markers to experiment with coloring my filament, Installed and tested. Works well.

    Print quality is now very good, and no more Z axis ribbing, no warped parts lifting off the bed during prints.

    Using my Robo 3D printer is now much easier and much less frustrating than when I started, I have paid the price of being on the bleeding edge of new technology, I hope that new users of 3D printers can appreciate the effort and costs the community of 3D'ers have endured so they could have a better 3D printing experience than we started with.

    The newer models are much improved and will continue to do so because of our community efforts. If you are a new user, reach out and thank one of us " old timers" for making it easier for you, and pass what you learn to others so their experience is better as well.

    Thanks for reading.
     

    Attached Files:

    #1 Bil Forshey, Mar 12, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2016
    Scifideity, Burncycle and Tom Finzel like this.
  2. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Messages:
    5,905
    Likes Received:
    3,593
    Technically you started with either a beta or a Kickstarter, the + was introduced this year.

    Stabilizers are not needed on the latest R1 and the PLUS since the smooth rods are now longer and sit in a socket on the underside of the cover

    Spool brackets are a good upgrade. I use one that is on the side, but I have also used top mounted ones.

    The linear rail upgrade for the Y axis allows more precision than the drawer rails from the kickstarter version but I know some have not upgraded or seen any problems. For even less maintenance and better performance changing out the LM8UU linear bearings for oil impregnated sintered bronze bushings would be a nice upgrade.

    Everyone should install either the XXL or the Full Graphics LCD Smart Controllers for all the reasons you mentioned.

    The E3Dv6 while not completely necessary is still a good upgrade especially if you want to extrude more flexible filaments. And all parts are replaceable too. The stud thermistor is more robust than the little glass bead also.

    If you don't already have a PLUS then the Z axis lead screw upgrade can be worthwhile. I chose to go my own route with this upgrade and accomplished the same results for one third the cost of the Robo sourced upgrade.

    I am not seeing any RF interference on my screen I would think the ferrite cores as a general upgrade would not be necessary. Of course specific machines may be different. What kind of scrambled data were you seeing? Was it just display or did it actually affect printing?

    I am surprised Robo could actually secure the bed with just three magnets, all later Robos have magnets at four corner locations. With mesh leveling enabled in the newest version of Marlin (not the newest version provided by Robo, which is older) my experience is that my biggest complaint about the bed flexing during auto-level is now completely mitigated.

    Since you are a tinkerer, here are a few things you could look into. Note that the glass bed used by Robo is not the best at conducting heat, it actually is a very good insulator. Robo's use of a relatively low wattage heater, as well as it being undersized (approximate coverage is just 67% of the build area) which can lead to large temperature differentials between the center and the outer edges of the build plate. I have measured as much as 40°C differences. A bed heater upgrade could be a nice addition. Please note that without using a MOSFET or relay or SSR your current draw through the RAMPS board should be under 11A max at 12V.

    Second, Have you thought about an enclosure such as the one designed by @Mike Kelly, it can go a long way to getting very repeatable printing results as you will have more control over the build environment. Especially useful in warp friendly filaments like ABS and some Nylons.

    One more addon I can't live without now that I have it is OctoPrint running on a Raspberry Pi directly connected to the Robo as well as my home network. I can actually upload gcode files to the microSD on the Pi or to the SD card in the LCD controller from any web browser on my network. You can start prints and monitor their progress using the local URL of the Pi. If you have port forwarding enabled through your router you could monitor prints through the cloud anywhere you have an internet connection. With the addition of a webcam, you could also see what is being printed as well as record time lapse videos of you models.

    I am glad that Robo has looked at the upgrades their users have done and incorporated a few of them into the current model. Are there things that still need addressing, of course, will it ever be a perfect printer, probably not, Is it Plug and Play, well not in it's current configuration. But all those things are solvable and people like yourself and others have provided me with a lot of ideas and knowledge on how to make my particular Robo better. To give credit where credit is due, it is this community that makes the Robo the great value it is today. Without the people here I know for myself, I would never have gotten the precision, repeatability and reliability I currently enjoy from my Robo R1.
     
    Scifideity likes this.
  3. Bil Forshey

    Bil Forshey Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2015
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    19
    Thanks for the reply, I agree with your comments.

    The bed heater is now a non-issue for me as the FLEKS3D build plate system doesn't require heating the bed at all for most filaments and recommends a maximum bed temperature of 60 degrees C, anyway, I guess that means i can skip the enclosure as well (sorry Mike that might have been my next purchase). It works fantastic! did I say that already, Check out their website if you get a chance, it's the best upgrade i have done yet. Worry free printing is now possible. It will work for almost any 3D printer model.

    Qctoprint sounds cool, but those are not features I need currently.
     
  4. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    Regarding the FLEKS3D build plate, did you have any luck getting ABS to stick? I have had zero luck so far with ABS, trying a different brand soon to see if that helps. Even the skirts come lose shortly after putting them down. I have messed with the bed temp and the extrusion temps. Any tips?
     
  5. Bil Forshey

    Bil Forshey Member

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2015
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    19

    ABS should stick very well.
    Check your Z height to make sure it is set correctly.
    Make sure you are printing on the rough side of the build plate.

    Your Z height should be set so that you can just slide a business card between the nozzle and the build plate. Home the printer then move the cold head to the center of the plate, then lower the head until you can just slide a business card under the nozzle, check the Z position value and use that as your Z height offset value in your slicer. Your slicer will add that value to all Z axis moves.

    You can make small advustments in your Z height and test printing until you get the correct value.
    If the Z height is set too high the filament won't stick well, if it is too low your filament may not extrude or the first layer height will be too short.
     
    Scifideity likes this.
  6. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    This actually helped a lot. Also moving to Simplify3D seemed to create better layers than Mattercontrol. I still have minor issues with warping on ABS, but it is way better than it was. Guess I need to tune/calibrate my machine more to get this working 100%.
     
  7. Scifideity

    Scifideity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    18
    Excellent post. I'm learning a lot while waiting on my LCD and printing some stands/legs, tool attachments, LCD enclosure, etc..

    @Bil Forshey : Which size FLEKS3D did you go with? There doesn't seem to be a perfect match for the ROBO 3D R1+

    @WheresWaldo : On the flip side of that question, What bed heater upgrade do you recommend?
     
  8. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    The 10x10 with the frame fits perfectly. The outside of the frame is flush with the glass.
     
    Scifideity likes this.
  9. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Messages:
    5,905
    Likes Received:
    3,593
    @Scifideity Depends on how much work you want to do. Biggest issue is that glass is an insulator and the current kapton heater only covers 67% of the build area. Those two things cause large differentials of temperatures between the center and edges of the build. If you want to the the least amount of modification at the lowest cost note these things;

    Your RAMPS board is limited to 11A continuous power output. As a result you are limited to a 132W heater (12v x 11A), you might be able to push 150W since bed heaters do not run continuously. I ordered my heater from AliBrothers in China. They will custom make the size you want for the cost of their standard next size up. Only took 10 days to the east coast.

    If you want more/larger/faster heating then you will need a relay or SSR to power the heater direct from the power supply, you turn the SSR on via the normal heater contacts on the RAMPS board. There are a ton of videos on YouTube that show how to use an SSR with bed heaters.
     
    Scifideity likes this.
  10. Scifideity

    Scifideity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    18
    Gotcha. I'm still in the "gathering info" phase and not ordering anything just yet. Still gotta get all the info and compare all the options.

    Thanks for the info.
     
  11. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    Here is the 10x10 Fleks3D plate and frame mounted on the R1+

    [​IMG]
     
    KTMDirtFace and Scifideity like this.
  12. Scifideity

    Scifideity Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2016
    Messages:
    74
    Likes Received:
    18
    Excellent. Thanks for posting that. It helps to have a visual to help with my decision. Is the reality/experience with it as easy and problem free as they claim?
     
  13. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    It is by no means perfect but it does work pretty well. ABS can be printed without heat but it is still temperamental at times with warping. PLA is pretty solid. The main benefit is the easier removal and no need for glues and adhesives.
     
    GAmbrosio and mark tomlinson like this.
  14. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2013
    Messages:
    23,912
    Likes Received:
    7,338
    Nature of the filament (the lack of a heated chamber makes solving it hard). There are alternative materials though.
     
  15. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2015
    Messages:
    5,905
    Likes Received:
    3,593
    What Mark said.

    With respect to all these surface preparations and ABS. I am very skeptical of all these claims of non-warping and printing with no heat. Every sample print I have seen is rather small and ABS has a huge shrinkage factor. Just because it is stuck to the plate all over doesn't necessarily mean the part isn't warped. These plates appear much more flexible than the glass or aluminum plates found on many printers. Some of the suppliers passively mention the plate itself bowing (warping) in certain conditions. Even the masters of ABS, LEGO, has to introduce errors in their injection molds in order to get dimensionally accurate and repeatable parts. They also use ABS of their own design, made by their own scientists. As a matter of public record, LEGO is also looking to dump ABS by the year 2030.

    I know that some say they use ABS because it can be vapor polished, but first it is likely that 99% (a number I made up but is probably close to the true number) of the ABS prints out there never see Acetone in any shape or form and also it is highly toxic to humans. The last time I used Acetone on ABS parts was to polish some golf club ferrules. There are so many other ways to finish prints that are safer.

    Now I do see a big advantage for plates like this on beds that do not have heaters, I am sure that Printrbot users love these. I am just not sure what the ROI is for filaments that already stick well without these types of plates.
     
  16. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2013
    Messages:
    23,912
    Likes Received:
    7,338

    WERD
    !
     
  17. danzca6

    danzca6 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2015
    Messages:
    2,161
    Likes Received:
    1,077
    th.jpg
     
  18. Bruce Jenkins

    Bruce Jenkins Member

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2016
    Messages:
    38
    Likes Received:
    17
    Thanks for your picture and review.
    I've been seriously looking into getting one of these.
    The little research I've done tells us not to let the hot end touch the fleks3d.

    How do you do the auto leveling routine at the beginning of each print on the Robo3d?
     
  19. danzca6

    danzca6 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2015
    Messages:
    2,161
    Likes Received:
    1,077
    I think it is more of not letting the nozzle touch when hot. So you would want to adjust your start code to not heat the hot end until after the ABL command.
     
  20. XEMA

    XEMA New Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2016
    Messages:
    27
    Likes Received:
    12
    Check out this thread
     

Share This Page