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Anyone own a CTC Duplicator 4?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by SteveDjarrell, Oct 5, 2016.

  1. SteveDjarrell

    SteveDjarrell Active Member

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    Hi guys, I was curious if any of you have a CTC Duplicator? the Makerbot clone? I have finally gotten my Robo R1 printing where I like. I have replaced all the bearings with Bronze Sleeve bearings. I have upgraded the extruder to a titan, Moved to a Prometheus V2 (year of use and still loving it), lead screw upgrade and did all the silly cable chain / cosmetic changes. I love it an the quality is very good now. so I am looking to get into the dual extrusion and I would like to tray a gantry style. SO I am looking at adding a CTC Duplicator 4 to my collection. I understand there are a lot of things on it to change/ upgrade / add to get it to be reliable but for 363.00 I have to take a look. Only thing that stops me is every video I have seen, the print quality is no where near what I am getting. Some of that is no doubt new users, but Out of the box I would expect more. so my question is, do any of you own one? Is it worth 400.00? would you buy it again if you have.
     
  2. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    Im sorry i dont own one. Typically dual extrusion printers are quite expensive to get one with good print quality. I personally would save up and get a better machine.

    Examples of the top of my head...the raise3d printer-Joel Telling reviews on youtube

    BCN Sigma- joel telling and richrap both reviewed (very loud machine).

    Keep in mind this is opinion not fact, if you want something to build up neither of those options are good ones but dual extrusion is VERY difficult to get good with
     
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  3. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    CTC did some nasty DRM stuff a while back with chipped filament that forced you to use their filament, so they're pretty high on my 'companies to avoid' list. If you've been seeing a bunch of terrible prints, why would you be interested in it?

    I'll second @Geof on the dual thing. Everyone I know who runs a dual nozzle single carriage type machine like that uses it almost exclusively as single and most have removed the second nozzle so it doesn't drag through the print.

    This year, we'll see some interesting single nozzle multiple feed systems (like Prusa's and the Prometheus), multiple carriage systems (like BCN), and more advanced dual nozzle single carriage systems that will likely bring us to real proper multimaterial / multicolor printing. CTC won't be driving that charge though :)
     
  4. SteveDjarrell

    SteveDjarrell Active Member

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    The prints I saw were all first run prints. So I do not put to much faith in the machine being setup or tweaked like I have had to do with my Robo. To be honest for the price I was truly considering it as a second printer. even with needing to fix or change things I was ok with it. Also lot of prints I see on the web from other printers just do not look as good or better than what I now get from my robo. I would like a second printer and have truly thought about getting a delta to play with but again it is the price point, the CTC duplicator is the same price as a small Delta kit. I have no previous knowledge of CTC and that is why I was asking. As for the dual extrusion I will be an early adopter of the Prometheus system as I love the hot end and Eric is very responsive to correspondence. thank you for the information, I appreciate it.

    -Steve
     
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  5. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    I think id steer clear of that specific brand printer. Expecially for upgrading I'd go with a more widely known totally open source. I3 kits come to mind as somewhere in that price range, easily upgraded lots of information/support. :) not trying to steer you away from anything by any means
     
  6. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    If multiple material extrusion is on the list go for the new Prusa :)
     
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  7. danzca6

    danzca6 Well-Known Member

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    still have to be of similar printing temp requirements. Can't do much where one requires a lot higher nozzle temp than the other with what Pruza or Prometheus are doing. Having independent hotends still have an advantage in that area.
     
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  8. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    You can do multiple materials they say but bed heat has to be similar. Prusa says the nozzle can heat up and cool back down for say xt and abs or what not. But.....print time would be seriously impacted.
     
    #8 Geof, Oct 6, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
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  9. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Yes, if you need wildly dissimilar materials then you absolutely need multiple extruders.
    People just need to be aware (before investing in that tech) how touchy it is to tune :)

    edit : and @Geof can speak on this from experience
     
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  10. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    It hates you....gremlins......gnomes.....two extruders is just hard lol.
     
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  11. SteveDjarrell

    SteveDjarrell Active Member

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    love the information / Ideas I get on here. So what about a Wanhoa Duplicator 6? Read both good and bad. Single Extruder, Gantry Style. Print quality looks pretty good. .060 high, .100 medium and .150 Low res..... Speed seems to be pretty good running a 80mm/sec and still getting good prints. Have learned to only purchase from a US based reseller. One in Odessa Florida, might check them out the next time I'm in TPA. still thing to change or make better but looks much better built and the new version shipping, well owners seem pretty happy.

    Again this is for a second printer. I love the R1 now after a year of upgrades....
     
  12. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    I dont personally know anyone that has one. They seem to have a pretty decent line of printers.

    I can speak to the gantry style:
    Its a whole different world in comparison to the robo (not a bad thing). I have 2 gantry style and for the most part they are quiter, seem to have higher resolution but much longer print times (which is expected with a higher resolution) regardless of print speed.

    My personal opinion with gantry style is Ultimaker has the most reliable version but at a cost.

    Hopefully this is good information and not just rambling :D
     
    #12 Geof, Oct 8, 2016
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2016
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  13. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
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    The quality I have seen out of the Ultimaker is incredible (wished I had one). Even though I want to believe I have my Robo setup perfectly, it pales in comparison quality wise. With 32-bit boards and firmwares used on the Duet or Smoothie I think we will see speeds increasing, up to the limit of the hardware provided.
     
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  14. SteveDjarrell

    SteveDjarrell Active Member

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    My next question was about to be on quality of the "Jacked up" Robo's vs Makerbot.... I like to think my quality is pretty good now, but I know it can be better but is it worth 2-3K? or is something out of a 800.00 printer going to be close enough to not justify the added expense. I do this strictly as a hobby and I am completely addicted. I also truly love upgrading and designing my own fixes. I tinker... But seriously is it that much better? Again, all information / opinion / experiences are very much appreciated.
     
  15. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    Some 3k printers are on a whole different level than our robos. Can our machines get there ? Quality wise my vote is yes, at the same speed or features ? I dont think so.

    That said... most 3k printers dont need tinkering :) just tweaking for filament and enviroment. If tinkering to get good quality is the goal those are not the style printers id shoot for. I love all my printers but each was bought for a specific need or want. :)

    If you give a budget, what you want to do with it, etc i can certainly throw out some opinions on machines and their need for tinkering or if they just work....or dont :)

    My vote is to always stay away from Makerbot... just bad buisness practices, bad product...anyway lol. Most people who live opensource can rant and rave about that specific company lol. Ill try not to anymore. :-D
     
  16. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Comparing the current robos to those printers is a losers game.
    They are much better quality construction period.

    Can the Robo do amazing quality prints? Yes, more so given how cheap it is in comparison, but do not be confused :)
     
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  17. Rigmarol

    Rigmarol Well-Known Member

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    My Robo is my one and only and I believe I've got a winner on my first buy.
    I am thinking of eventually getting a Prusa kit, I like what I keep hearing about it.
     
  18. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
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    The R1 is a good printer that can be had for a good price and with a bit of tinkering and maybe an upgrade or two it can elevate itself to just below the level of a great printer. I would still recommend it as a first printer to a lot of people.

    My fear is that the higher priced R2 will be about as good as the current R1+PLUS printer. It has the potential to be better but in-house statements about quality should only be accepted as marketing propaganda. Until unaffiliated third parties do comprehensive reviews I wouldn't even trust Kickstarter supporters impressions (When was the last time you saw someone who has a vested interest in something give an objective review). Robo tried that with a few YouTubers but somehow that didn't really work out too well for them. They haven't really done anything like that since.

    There are quite a few gantry style printers and even a moving bed design or two that are very good quality wise. The TAZ line, the Prusa stuff are among those with a moving bed that work well. Nearly every gantry printer, with the exception of the cheapest Chinese clones are all fair and can be very good with some care in assembly (or re-assembly). Websites like OpenBuilds.com have many open source options that also can shine with respect to print quality. I am sure the Wanhao/CTC/Monoprice/etc. clone of the Makerbot 4 is also a pretty good printer. There is a lot of support, albeit scattered across several forums, for this printer as well as mods to make it better.
     
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  19. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    They should make one of the prototypes available to Tam Sanlanderer (https://www.youtube.com/user/ThomasSanladerer) and then I would trust the review (and so would lots of other folks I bet)
     
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  20. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
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    Thomas Sanladerer might be an excellent choice as well as Joel (The 3D Printing Nerd), they would give honest evaluations of not only the print quality but also the value proposition. I think that is something Robo isn't entirely confident in, hence their reluctance to have review units available. It can't be about $$$, because if they are so strapped for cash that they don't have a review unit or two, they are on much shakier ground than they are letting on.

    Joel just did reviews of the rather old Ultimaker 2+, the Lulzbot (Taz 6 & Mini) and the Prusa i3 Mk2, the Wanhao Duplicator i3 (Prusa clone) and was even at Matt's Printed Solid grand opening.

    I try to be fair about stuff I use but after spending a lot of hard earned money it is sometimes hard to see the faults of a product for what they are. I can honestly say that out of the box, the R1 was less than impressive, after many hours and many modifications later it is much better. That said there are still better out of the box experiences to be had with many printers in the same price range. But as I mentioned, if I had a buddy that wanted a printer and help setting it up and was willing to tinker, I would recommend the R1+PLUS, partly because of the potential, mostly because I know it well. The new stuff out their, I will reserve judgement.
     

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