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birchwood for the abs upgrade???

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by CAMBO3D, Mar 22, 2013.

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  1. CAMBO3D

    CAMBO3D New Member

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    why robo3d? is this a cost factor? there are better materials.
     
  2. Seshan

    Seshan Active Member

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    Yes, this concerns me, I was trying to stay away from wood in my printer, specially for a build platform, and a large one at that. Unless the birchwood goes on top of the acrylic, then fine, but considering it costs $100 for the heated bed, I'd expect something better then birchwood. It's also 1/4'' thick, which is not really thick, but thin.
     
  3. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    I can appreciate that as an initial reaction, but you may want to wait until you see it. A lot of the bots out there use birchwood for a frame and are rock solid. The Ultimaker, which is one of the best, if not the best, out there uses 1/4" birch all around.

    A possible advantage to wood is that it is probably going to be easier to peel the kapton tape off when you need to change it.

    I know there is a another machine out there that uses a wood build plate, but can't remember which. Maybe someone can do a search and see which one to point people to the feedback on it?

    Another point is that you should probably consider your bed to be a wear part anyways. You're going to inevitably scuff it up over time. Then you upgrage to borosilicate glass or marble. Or you decide to start running Nylon and get some Garolite. Maybe once people start using their printers and want to upgrade, a few of us can get a group buy on some borosilicate glass started.

    My small complaint on the update is that they didn't provide any of the information people are looking for to get started on upgrades (other than the rods)
     
  4. Harry

    Harry Team ROBO 3D
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    Hey Guys. Where do you see they are using the Birchwood, and for what exactly? Thanks, and i'll point this towards them.
     
  5. Seshan

    Seshan Active Member

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    It says on their material list posted in the latest update, for ABS upgrade they are using birchwood, PLA is using acrylic.

    @printed solid, I know some printers use them, and that's why it bothers me, I've read about printers that use it as a build platform and it just causes problems, it warps and changes when heated, also humidity can effect wood, there is a reason why Makerbot went away from wood frames, Luckily our frame isn't wood. Also the RoBo's built platform is much larger then most, which can cause even more problems since there is more wood to warp. We also wouldn't be printing right on the wood, since the heated PCB needs to go on top of it.
     
  6. JDM_

    JDM_ New Member

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    I'm also consirned about warping. I ordered a thick piece or garolite and was just going to use those big black paperclip thingies to hold it on top of the existing platform but now Im thinking I could just replace the birchwood with it.
    I was wondering if you had put the heating element on top or if it could be under the garolite? Would it headt he bed enough to prevent ABS warping from under the garolite?
     
  7. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    Maybe Harry can clear up whether the actual build surface is wood or if the wood is just the carriage, which then has HBP board, and some other build platform material (borosilicate glass would be spectacular if they're taking requests:D). I read it as the actual material you are printing on is black birch which would have a heated PCB beneath it.

    I really don't think people should be scared of the wood :eek: As a mechanical engineer in the medical and aerospace industries, wood isn't even something I consider when designing, but I really think it works great in these printers. The laminated birch that is used is light, strong, and flat.

    The Ultimaker is an absolutely awesome printer with a wooden z-axis platform and wooden z-axis arms. The actual stock build platform (i.e. what you are printing onto) is acrylic, but people have switched it out with other materials depending on what they are printing (aluminum, glass, garolite, etc). Here is a pic: 2013-03-23 14.59.14.jpg

    @Seshan: In my opinion, the reason that Makerbot went away from wood is about 10% to get a more stable frame and 90% for people to perceive that they have a higher quality product. I have a rep 1 with a wood frame and wood z-axis carriage. I run it at 120mm/s and 50um regularly and am quite happy with it. There are some reliability issues with the electronics. The ABS arms that attach the z-axis carriage to the rails are horribly designed and sag under temperature due to a coefficient of thermal expansion issue. BUT, neither of those issues has anything to do with the wood frame or the wood z-axis carriage. I have read and experienced plenty of issues with rep 1, but none really due to the wood construction.

    @justin: you want your garolite to be what your are printing nylon directly onto. ABS would be kapton tape on top of that nylon. circuit board goes underneath the garolite.
     
  8. JDM_

    JDM_ New Member

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    @printed solid when you say "circuit board" are you referring to the heated pad?
     
  9. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    yes. Sorry. I can see how that might have been confusing.
     
  10. Harry

    Harry Team ROBO 3D
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    I have pointed this post to the team. They'll get an answer written up, or i'll write something if they get back to me first.
     
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