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PLA Adhesion

Discussion in 'General Questions' started by AlienBeans, Jun 18, 2017.

  1. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    All my initial prints have come out very nice, but I finally came to the end of the spool of PLA that came with the printer. I had to change it in the middle of a job. The job continued and finished perfectly. This morning I changed the filament to a different color but still PLA. I started a job and left it alone to print. I didn't change any settings at all, just used what I've been using since I got the printer (defaults). I came in the room 3-4 hours into the print and noticed the left side in the front was curled just a bit off the bed. Then I looked at the right side and realized the print is not even at all. (see picture attached) I stopped the job because I knew it wasn't going to correct. I didn't expect to have this problem with PLA. Print bed was at 60Celsius. Not sure what the hotend was at. I just didn't pay attention to it. Has anybody else experienced this behavior with PLA and if so, how did you correct it.
     

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  2. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson (⌐■_■)
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    Usually with a different spool.

    While that can be too much heat, PLA is not a filament that tends to warp-n-curl so when it does it is usually bad filament.
    Granted you shouldn't need 60 C on the bed and you can try printing it cooler (room temp is fine for PLA, but I usually go 40-ish)
     
    #2 mark tomlinson, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
  3. colton81

    colton81 Active Member

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    Yea i would agree with bad filament. Had the same issue with mine the pla was left out for 2 months and i started having curling issues swapped to new pla and no issues. I would swap the pla and test it out and see if it continues to happen.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  4. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    Interesting that it would be bad filament. I just took this out of the package prior to starting the print job. I don't see a setting anywhere to adjust the temperature of the build plate. Is this something that is changed after the print job is sent to the printer?

    nevermind, I found it.
     
    #4 AlienBeans, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
  5. colton81

    colton81 Active Member

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    Are you using Cura to slice it or the built in slicer? I believe cura has a setting to change the bed temp


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  6. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    I'm using Cura to slice it. I found the bed temperature setting, so we'll see how it goes. I just started the job again.
     
  7. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson (⌐■_■)
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    It is not unheard of to get a bum spool of filament (it has happened to me as well)
    If you bought a brand name simply get them to replace it (most will).

    PLA can "go bad" by absorbing moisture out of the air (if it was kept sealed with desiccant this should be an issue, but you never know)
     
  8. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    I bought the filament from ROBO and left it sealed until I opened it this morning.
     
  9. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson (⌐■_■)
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    Again, not unheard of to get a bad spool :)
    Try the temperatures and if it still misbehaves you should contact the store/vendor.
     
  10. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    Well, I lowered the bed temperature to 50 and started the print again. A little over an hour into the print and the entire front of the piece is lifting off the print bed. I decided to abort the print job rather than waste the filament. There are several things in the manual it says to try if this happens, so I'm going to run through some of those and see what happens before I contact robo about replacing the filament.
     
    #10 AlienBeans, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
  11. Ed Ferguson

    Ed Ferguson Active Member

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    Yeah that much curl is weird.

    I did notice an issue with my R2 shortly after trying it out. I had a small print that did not adhere well to the bed, even though my filament and settings were unchanged. So I wiped the bed with a paper towel and isopropyl alcohol on the hunch my fingers had left some oil on the bed. Then the print ran fine. So I now wipe the bed before every print.

    Also, my Simplify 3D slicer lays down the first layer with no fans running, 50% speed, and 130% height & width - all to improve adhesion. Don't know what Cura is doing on the first layer.

    The only other remedy I've used for curling corners (this was on the Robo R1+) was to use an 8-10 line width brim.
     
  12. AlienBeans

    AlienBeans Member

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    I will try wiping it down with some alcohol as well. I did a few settings tweaks, and switched to a different color. I'm printing in that color now and it started off well, but it appears the front right corner is lifting just like the other spool did. I changed to the current spool that is printing, in the middle of a job yesterday when my filament ran out. So far the only filament that has worked and hasn't curled is the spool that came with the unit. I lowered the build plate to 40C and dropped the fans down to 30% (per the manual). OK. UPDATE: That was a disaster. I went to check on the print and everything had come completely loose on the build plate. Raft and all was sliding around while it was trying to print. I promptly canceled the print.
     
  13. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson (⌐■_■)
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    Yep, you can try a wide brim (slicer setting) as @Ed Ferguson suggested, but again ... when I have had PLA do that it was invariably a bad spool. It doesn't react that way normally.
     
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  14. Ed Ferguson

    Ed Ferguson Active Member

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    While there can be variability between filaments and temperature settings, the fact that the print came completely loose points to looking at the bed and offset adjustments before doing anything else.

    You probably know there are three items to perform in sequence out of the box:

    1. Run the "Bed Calibration" wizard. This prompts you through the process of using a paper feeler gauge to manually level the bed (using the thumbscrews at the four corners) to minimize any tilt.

    2. Next, run the "Z-Offset" wizard. This feeler gauge process gets the offset close enough to run the following step.

    3. Next, run the "Fine Tune Offset" wizard. It prints a straight line. Use the up/down buttons to move the bed as needed. It then prints another line. Repeat adjustments until you have a semi-compressed line that sticks. I use the plastic stylus to nudge the printed line each time. If it's not sticking, jog the bed up slightly and test again. Don't over-compress; you just want enough to get the line to stick. When finished, press Save. My Fine Tune Offset ended up being -7.60

    Finally, the R2's IR probe automatically levels the bed in software each time you print.

    I would do the above steps and run a test print. Then, based on the results, start looking at other factors.
     
    #14 Ed Ferguson, Jun 18, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2017
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  15. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    chiming in since its PEI...I use the rough green side of a kitchen sponge then wipe it down with rubbing Alcohol, sometimes PEI is dirtier than it looks which leads to serious headaches. PEI must be clean or you will warp and fall off the bed (not saying thats your problem, just saying thats what I do and dont experience that issue anymore)
     
  16. Erica Lindström

    Erica Lindström New Member

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    Awesome! I just tried this with my R2, since I had trouble with curling corners on big flat prints, and it worked like magic!
    Thank you, Thank you!
    I will do this prior every print I do further on.
     
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  17. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    I probably do it about twice a day. Normally (as long as you dont touch it) you can get by with just a few times if you print alot. (maybe even once a day)
     
  18. Ivan Handler

    Ivan Handler New Member

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    You might try a raft, this has helped me with PLA warping on occasion.
     
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  19. OutsourcedGuru

    OutsourcedGuru Active Member

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    It's interesting that it's only warping on one corner and not the others...? as well as it looks like the part is diagonally-tapered from left to right. For this reason, the bed calibration suggestion would sound reasonable.

    Verify the Z-offset yields a flat/even/squashed first layer, add a raft/brim or similar. A huge brim grabs on and helps with adhesion. It cools faster (since it's thinner) and in theory then won't be as affected by hot layers on top of that wicking that heat down to the tape & first layer.
     

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