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Unanswered Edges lifting/warping

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by Nic Phillips, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. Nic Phillips

    Nic Phillips New Member

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    I apologize if this has been addressed elsewhere. I searched, but couldn't find a thread with an answer.

    Yesterday, I tried to print out one half of a spool holder for my R1. After a couple of tweaks, the first layer went down perfectly, smooth, solid, no gaps or ridges, couldn't ask for a better result. I was in my office and kept an eye on the print for the first several layers, all of which looked great. I left the job to finish on it's own and came back a couple hours later to see the end result. What I saw was a real bummer. The edges of my print had warped in several places and lifted off of the bed (see photo). Aside from this, the rest of the print looked great. I'm not sure what the likely cause of this is, but would love input from anyone who has resolved similar issues. Thanks!

    DETAILS:

    Filament: 1.75mm White PLA
    Extruder: 191°C
    Bed Temp: 70°C
    Fan turned off for first 2 layers
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Lanny0914

    Lanny0914 New Member

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    Hi, I had this same issue. Use extra hairpray on the bed at that corner, and it will lie flat. Usually the corners furthest from the center of the bed require a little more hairspray in my experience.
     
  3. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    You can also try to print a little hotter to see if that helps
     
  4. Nic Phillips

    Nic Phillips New Member

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    I tried both of the above suggestions (used more hairspray and raised the extruder temp a couple degrees), but got the same result. Any other thoughts?
     
  5. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    I typically run my heater at 60 for the bed and 195 for the extruder. What slicer do you use ? Is your first layer getting "squished" good ? I have also use a combo of glue stick and hairspray on the corners of the heated bed as the heater isn't the best out there
     
  6. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Counter-intuitive, but have you tried dropping the bed temp?
    This is PLA... does it need that hot of a bed to actually stick?

    All of the filaments can do the warp thing if you don't control the temperature across it (difficult with no heated chamber).
    PLA usually sticks without nearly that hot of a bed which will help reduce the heat delta.
     
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  7. Nic Phillips

    Nic Phillips New Member

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    I think it's a cooling issue. I lowered the in-fill a bit so that there will be less hot plastic retracting to pull up on the edges and I'm going to try printing it with a good sized brim to see if that helps. Here goes nothing...
     
  8. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Reducing the amount of plastic you lay down will help as well. Let us know.
     
  9. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    Yes please let us know how you get along and thee solution(s) as others that reactors post might find answers they are looking for
     
  10. Nic Phillips

    Nic Phillips New Member

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    I ran a third print with much better results. For those who want the technical details, I am using MatterControl with MatterSlice as the slice engine. Also, I did not alter the temperature settings from my second attempt. Relevant print settings follow:

    First layer speed: 30%
    Infill: 20%
    Extruder Temperature: 193C
    Print Bed Temperature: 70C
    First Layer Extrusion Width: 120%
    Disable Fan for First 2 Layers​

    I also printed the part with a brim by adjusting the skirt settings as follows:

    Loops: 20
    Distance from Object: Touching - 0mm​

    The result was a thin brim along the edge of the object extending out by just shy of 10mm. There was still a slight amount or cooling warp on the corners in question, but not nearly as pronounced as in the first two attempts -- and for this particular job, I am able to use part as it printed this time around without issue.

    I am going to attempt to print the other half of the spool holder today and will be adjusting a couple of things in hopes of further improving the results. First, I plan to slow the fan speed to 75-80%, rather than running it at full speed, in an attempt to produce a more gradual cooling process that I hope will reduce the internal pulling that is lifting my corners. I figure the part is big enough that it has a lot of time to cool between layers already and likely does not need as much fan assistance to prepare for subsequent layers. Additionally, I am going to rotate the model 90-degrees so that its length runs along the x-axis, rather than the y-axis. My hope is that this may also help make my temp-delta more consistent by keeping the model a bit less exposed to the cooler air outside of the printer and reducing the y-axis movement needed for printing. Using an infrared thermometer, I also found that the bed temperature seems to be significantly more consistent along the length of the x-axis, with only a 2-3 degree drop at the extremities, compared to the temperature lost at the far points of the y-axis, which were as high as 7-8 degrees. Here's to hoping for a good result!
     
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  11. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
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    @Nic Phillips as @mark tomlinson mentions you do not need that much heat to get PLA to stick to the bed, I routinely print PLA (Actually I don't print a lot of PLA) at a bed temperature of just 50°C. In the room where the printer is that is about a 28°C (82°F) differential in temperature over ambient. I have had PLA warp on me even with that low a temp differential. It really would benefit you to lower the bed temp to 50°C or even lower.
     
  12. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Yep. I use 45 myself and even then that is really just a panacea since I have tested it at room temp.
    I use the 45 just to get it bumped a bit in case the A/C is having a good day and the room and bed are colder :)
     
  13. Nic Phillips

    Nic Phillips New Member

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    Oops! I forgot to drop it back down, which I meant to do. At any rate, I also forgot to rotate the print orientation as I mentioned in my last update, so I cancelled it and am about to restart it now. I'll try the bed at 50C and see how it goes. Thanks!
     
  14. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Good luck. PLA is usually not susceptible to warp and curl, but any of the filaments I have tried can do that if the settings are just right :)

    Some (like ABS) only do it on days of the week that end in a 'Y'.
     
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  15. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    Abs.... Bought one spool and there it still sits after one very frustrating day :).... Oddly enough i bought ngen,xt and petg and forgot all about abs until I read this :).... In my experience I havnt had abs curl but below 60 on the bed in my house (60 all year round :) ) and I do run the risk of it coming lose. I also can't print on just clean glass sadly
     
  16. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    It takes some fine-tuning of the Z offset/initial spacing for the first layer. I wouldn't worry about it if everything else is working, Printing on the bare glass is possible, but for over a year I used painters tape and glue stick -- great prints. Now it is bare glass with some hairspray, but the print quality is still the same :) It can be dialed in for that, but don't mess with success.
     
  17. Geof

    Geof Volunteer Moderator
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    I can print with hairspray but can't clean glass :(
     
  18. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    I have had fine results w/o the hairspray. It is more of a panacea at this point than a real solution to a problem for me.
     

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