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Change filaments on the fly

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by tesseract, Nov 15, 2013.

  1. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    alertmsg.gif
    Here is my process I put this alert bar at the top so I can at least try and prevent people who are new to 3d printing from attempting something that could cause issues on their printer. To use this process a recessed hobbed bolt is almost required as it helps in the alignment of things. This process can also help in the dreaded might run out of filament scenario as well.

    The process is quite simple as many have stated it is simply pausing the print and replacing the filament the trick is not to let the extruder move. The main difference in this method and the one I used on the color cube is that this can be done on the fly where as that other one had to have the gcode adjusted prior to the beginning of a print.This one requires no modification to gcode at all.

    This is how I do it and in the print below I did it seven times with success.
    Some of the procedures used are not best practice when 3d printing so proceed with caution


    1. -- Pause the print
    2. -- Raise Z axis about 10mm (this prevents excessive melting of the print)
    3. -- Set manual extrusion rate to about 300
    4. -- set retraction to about 135mm and hit retract button (this pulls out the old filament)
    5. -- Now Keeping the extruder closed feed the new filament into the hole at the top where it normally goes down until it hits the RECESSED hobbed bolt. This process mandates the the center of the recessed hole is in line with the hole on the top of the hot end assembly.
    6. -- set extrusion to about 135mm -150mm the variance in length is depends on how are accurate you are with guiding the filament. Hit the extrude button now by guiding it (blindly) into the proper position the hobbed bolt will grab the filament and center it in the recessed area and then guide it into the hot end.
    7. -- When you feel the extruder has gotten hold of it you can do a quick visual check to make sure it is not coming out side ways but check quickly then grab your small cricut spatula and place it between the nozzle and the print and angle it so it deflects the extruded filament away from the print. as soon as the filament stops extruding use the spatula to scrape off the nozzle. If the extruder stops extruding and you saw no new filament get extruded that you may not have had it extrude long enough. The key here is you need to learn what the distance is so that you can do it in one pass time is kind of critical so in this case too much is better the result would be a bit more filament lost in the transition.
    8.-- Lower Z axis by 10mm to bring it back to the print and let it rest for two seconds there to remelt the last bit of filament it had extruded previously.
    9. -- Continue the print

    and you are done.

    I am sure this would work with materials to you just have to add in the temp changes required as well probably
    step 1-A, -- Change temp


    So you have to be very familiar with the workings of the components of your printer and the right pieces in place the RECESSED hobbed bolt probably being the most critical.

    I have to save good luck but I take no responsibility if you jam up your extruder or have other issues related to trying the process out BUT I do take full credit for the idea and the steps to do it. LOL

    Again good luck and have fun with it.
    I hope to see some very creative new prints come out because of this.

    Jeff 2013-11-13 23.01.40.jpg 2013-11-14 00.59.24.jpg
     
    6 people like this.
  2. Thor

    Thor Member

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    Another tip to go with what you're doing -- you might want to replace your stock extruder hinge with the one on thingiverse ( http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:69794 -- gregs_wade_hinge_1) -- it has a thumb-pull so you can pull the lid away and change filaments without having to undo the screws...

    I was going to add a thumb-pull, but it looks like someone already did that for me :)
     
  3. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    He actually doesn't loosen his filament tensioners at all doing this. It's based completely on extrusion/retraction
     
  4. Billm

    Billm Member

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    i noticed that you were printing directly to the glass. i cant get it to work on glass and have been using the blue printers tape. i have my head level to the bed and set to .005" above the glass. The printers tape is .003 thick. what do you put on the glass to make the pla stick to it? when i set the head to the thickness of paper (.003") above the tape the first layer dosent always stick.
     
  5. AutopsyTurvy

    AutopsyTurvy Active Member

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    I'm not tesseract, buuut.... Played a lot with adhesion and PLA.

    Hair spray on the glass works well with PLA - I've tried tape and that works about equally well to get it to stick, but I don't like it as much (had some of the colour of the tape end up on the bottom of my print, and if I get the Z too low then it scrapes up the tape and I have to put down new tape). Get it wrong with hair spray and you just scrape off any misprinted plastic, get the print head out of the way, and give it another mist.

    Just have to get the right hair spray, and do it correctly - I had one brand of hair spray that didn't work well at all, and even with a good working brand, it has to be applied correctly - a few very light coats give just enough "tooth" to the bed for grip, but too heavy a coat and it becomes smooth and slick.

    Having the z height exactly right is pretty important too - that first layer should be ever so slightly compressed by the extruder height. Too high and it won't stick, too low and the next layer will distort/melt the first layer. I usually watch closely and twiddle the threaded rods manually for the first layer till it's perfect - having it print a good skirt/brim is helpful for this as it gives you time to twiddle and get it just so. When you're using just glass/hair spray, can do this both visually and by the sound - too low and it makes a sound like a glass cutter as it scrapes the glass (and the line laid down looks like train tracks - high on either side, low in the middle), too high and you can see a slight diagonal line as the filament comes out of the extruder but before it touches the glass. Just right and there's no sound besides the motors, and the filament will look smooth and, in cross section, would be a flattened oval on its side.
     
  6. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    Just for clarity and for those who did not know we think the chemicals that need to be in the list of ingredients in the hairspray are these two

    VA/Crotonates/Vinyl Neodecanoate Copolymer,
    Acrylates Copolymer

    If either one is in it it seems to work well if both are in it it works really well if neither is then it usually doesn't work too well

    Our Aquanet has both as seen here
    ingredients.jpg
     
  7. AutopsyTurvy

    AutopsyTurvy Active Member

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    How the heck do you get such purity of colour using this technique? Because even just switching colours between prints rather than on the fly, I get significant blending of colours initially, and then even a loooong time later, I'll get random blobs or runs of the old colour...

    Like, I have a thing printing now that I switched from yellow to white, and the first ~20 layers or so are sort of a pale yellow, and then mostly white, but then round about layer 200, the layers turn pale yellow again for about 10 or 20 layers, and then back to white. Same thing with another print, got past the inital blending by extruding first to try to clear the nozzle, but then it suddenly blobbed bits of blue on the top flat surface, when I hadn't printed blue in days!
     
  8. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    I was going to say one thing but I just thought about it and I think the answer is I am using the E3d hotend and it is very simple in how the filament flows no nooks and crannies to get caught in flow seems to be quite good throughout the hotend.

    I have a transition period where it is one color and the is a mixture and then is the second color of maybe 50 to 100mm of extruded material. Once it transitions I never have seen a patch of the original color.

    In my process I retract the material out and then insert the filament and extract until one of two conditions occurs and I continue down one of two paths at that point if I want a short seemless transition as soon as I see filament begin to extrude I return to printing it will continue for a short time in the original, then the mix, then the new as mentioned, but again this is only for about 100mm max.

    If I want an abrupt change I keep extruding until I see the transition is fully to the new color and then I continue the print and the color change is how you see it in the pics.

    Actually when I was doing these I may have always continued when I saw filament extrude regardless of color so you may see some transition (short though they may be) and abrupt changes. Both are hard to see though
     
  9. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    OH by the way upload some pics of your color changes I have not seen anyone else color changes at all I thought I was the only one doing it and was wondering why.......
     
  10. Billm

    Billm Member

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    When you print pla to glass, what bed temperature do you use, if any?
     
  11. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    none at all just hairspray and the correct initial height for starting prints(that is the biggest part of it)
     
  12. sebrobin

    sebrobin Member

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    Can you please tell me which model of aquanet do you use ?
    Are they all working fine ?
     
  13. scotta

    scotta Active Member

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    I use UHU glue stick and a bed temperature of 70C for PLA. No problems with not sticking.
     
  14. SteveC

    SteveC Well-Known Member

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    I think it is called Aquanet Professional or Extra Strength Unscented. The can is purple. Sometimes it holds too well so I'm going to try glue stick for models with a large contact area.
     
  15. Thor

    Thor Member

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    SteveC - it's a little messy, but for large models you can unstick it by 2 ways:
    1. [Cleaner] - Use can of Dusting air upside down -- the thermal shock usually lets the part snap right off.
    2. [Messier] - The models tend to be porous... put water or alcohol on them and wait 2 minutes.

    OTOH, I cheaped out, and am using Vidal Sassoon Flexible Hold ($3 at big lots -- red can)... it doesn't hold nearly as well, but for most models it holds ok. Don't do thin vertical pillars with it, but as long as you have 1 sq mm contact, it holds ok. (I still use purple when it counts though).
     
  16. JohnStack

    JohnStack New Member

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    Really great post! Thanks for posting this one. I need more PLA and I'm definitely going to try this.

    I'll try this and then I think I might also try Ninjaflex / PLA or Ninjaflex/ABS. Not sure how it will work but think about the silly stuff you can make with that!

    Thanks again!
     
  17. miaxix888

    miaxix888 New Member

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    Not sure if it's just luck but I've been using the makerbot PLA filaments with no issues, they stick on either glass with no hair spray, with/without tape. But the key is to make sure that the filaments are squish during the printing process.
     
  18. Red Submarine

    Red Submarine Active Member

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    I take it you are printing this with a USB cable? I'm using the LCD and it won't let me control the motors once the print is running, I can only pause the print or adjust speed, feed rates, etc. so I've been struggling with G-code edits. Maybe I'll try a print like this with the USB cable instead of the LCD
     
  19. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    If you are using teh standard rep rapLCD controller it has the pause print and I though you could manipulate the motors after things are started mine is off so I cannot check but I was moving the motors manually all the time when working on the dual just can't remember if it was during a print LOL
     
  20. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    That is an excellent starting point but as the bases of the prints get to be larger, contiguous and flatter there will be tendency to lift even with PLA but IMO the hairspray can only help
     

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