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Solved Z Axis limit switch puzzler

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by David Carter, Dec 15, 2018.

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  1. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    I'm having bed leveling problems. I know it's probably my limit switches but I can't figure it out. I've attached a video.

    I seem to be able to home properly (G28). But when I try a G29 I get odd behaviour. It goes up instead of down, MOST of the time. I can manually trip the Z axis limit switches so I know they're working, but I'm guessing one gets stuck or is out of adjustment?

    Some background on this... I replaced the X axis rods and bearings as I seemed to be getting a lot of vibrations when traversing X. It homed fine before, but not after. Not sure it's related, but just plain not sure.

    R1+
     
  2. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    And apparently my file refuses to upload. So here's the video of the issue:

     
  3. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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  4. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    Watched the video and it's not helping at all. It is stuff I knew already, although watching again certainly didn't hurt. I'm getting consistently inconsistent results, even when I take the wires off one end but not the other, and then reverse it. Or if I try manually opening and closing the circuit using the bare wires. I just can't narrow down where the fault is occurring.

    I suspect something is getting stuck mechanically, but even if I can determine where I have no idea what to do about it. There's nothing to lubricate or adjust as far as I can tell.
     
  5. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    On the Z limits? No nothing to lubricate. The adjustment is as mentioned in the video: loosening the carriage mount that holds the switch and making sure it is snug up against the crossbar with the Z Nut fully seated in the crossbar (and all of that done with the extruder in the air/off the bed).

    Other than that a bad switch or wire or other electronics is the only real culprit and that is less likely so make sure you can rule that out.

    You can test the switches at any time/position by issuing an M119 in the Gcode terminal while connected to the printer. That will tell you what the printer "sees":

    > M119
    Reporting endstop status
    x_min: open
    y_min: open
    z_min: TRIGGERED
    z_probe: open
    filament: open
     
    #5 mark tomlinson, Dec 15, 2018
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2018
  6. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    Wow. Don't know how I missed that one. M119 is magic. And yes, I'm getting Z triggered after 'G1 Z10'
     
  7. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    OK, that is 10mm off the bed and probably should not be reading triggered :)


    Endstops are reported as either “open” or “TRIGGERED”.

    (where triggered is "home")
     
  8. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    Well, my Z switches are definitely sticking both open and closed, but I'm not seeing where or how.

    Is it possible that if my X axis rods are a mm or 2 too long that it might have this effect? I had to trim down the rods I have and I'm sure I got them to very near the exact length, but they might be very slightly off
     
  9. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    The Z rod length has no impact on this in any way since it is simply a mechanical check of the carriage being positioned correctly on the switches. If the Z Rods are physically there and the carriage is moving up/down then there is no issue with the rods.

    I have had switches go bad, but usually they fail in one state or the other and not really get "intermittent" failures, but with a switch anything is possible so you can't rule that out.

    It does begin to sound like one of the switches is the problem if you have ascertained that they are both mounted correctly on the Z nuts and that the Z nuts are also mounted/fitting correctly into the crossbar.
     
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  10. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    It's not the Z rod that's changed, it's the X rods. My thinking is maybe this is pushing outwards on the carriage enough to cause it to stick?

    I don't think it's the switches... both would have to fail in the same way. I've tried to carriage at both extremes with similar results.
     
  11. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Maybe, if the X rods are putting enough pressure on the Z rods and you have the case cover on with the tops of the Z rods captured ... maybe.

    You could test that by removing the case :) This will let the Z rods expand out the small amount and that might impact it.

    I have (other than the C2) exactly one of three other R1/R1+ printers that still has a cover on it. I just don't leave them on.
     
  12. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    Cover is off already. Le sigh.
     
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  13. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Then I have a hard time imagining that the X rods are pushing it out far enough to do that.
    I mean, that would be a lot more than a mm or two I imagine. The crossbar itself is the key part here and that didn't change.
    More likely still a switch either out of place or defective. Make certain that the Z nuts are all the way into the crossbar and that the switches are freely moving and NOT loose in the mounts.

    Could it be the wiring or the RAMPS? Yea, but that is much less common.
     
  14. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    Doing some measurements, I see that the Z rods are bowing out at the top when the carriage is at the bottom, and that the carriage is looser on the limit switches at the top, so I'm thinking the rod lengths is the problem. After disassembly I'm noticing that the stock rods had more of a chamfer than the replacement. This wouldn't be a problem if the sockets were square, but they're not.

    I think I have a date with a dremel.
     
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  15. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    The while concept here is that the Arduino drives the Z down until one of those switches shows "triggered" (which means it is open) and then it knows the extruder nozzle is on the bed.

    Yes, if they are bowing I would address that :) Let us know
     
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  16. David Carter

    David Carter Member

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    So it does appear that the bowing was the issue. A little bit of grinding and coaxing with a small hammer to ensure the rods were seated properly, and I'm now leveling fine.
     
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  17. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Excellent catch
     
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