Getting there, need yoda's help

In all fairness I haven't really put alot of time into the printer, and at the beginning I couldn't get anything to work. Since then I've only stopped using vinyl on bed, stopped using bed heated, re-adjusted the Z height (tried auto level wasn't working for me) and started using green masking tape.

I'm beginning to get reliable / consistent results with some exceptions... if some helpful Robo3D yoda, 'help he will' , it would be appreciated.

Biggest issues I'm having:

(1) Green Painters Tape (aka Painter's Mate Green) is sticking, REALLY well, a little too well where removing the part usually pulls the tape up and as with the LCD top shown below ended up leaving residue on surface (which I'm still unable to remove). Is the Blue tape a better choice...Brand/Model of the tape used?

(2) The photos show the filament lines a little exaggerated (not so noticeable to naked eye), but hey maybe that is my problem... some of the filament breaks away on parts with straight lines (after printing) like it's not melting/fusing together with adjacent filament.

(3) first 2 layers appear to print perfectly and seem to almost always mess up on the 3rd or 4th layers, start getting messy/stringy, then finish the rest of the part fine (or relatively fine - other points). Does this have something to do with the fan kicking in on the 3rd layer (?? not sure what and why always on the 3rd ish layer).

(4) The beveled corners on the LCD top part in the pictures got very 'rough', not sure why.

Using MatterControl
Temp: 205/200
Bed Temp: 0/0
Layer Height: 0.2046mm
Slic3r
On this part:
Fill Density: 0.5
Fill Pattern: honeycomb
Support Material: Off
Auto Cooling: On
Speed or Extrusion Multiplier: 1

Any recommendations would be appreciated, it is a little frustrating when everything is in the crapper and you adjust one little item (Z height for example) and everything starts to print reasonably well... Scares me to make any drastic changes, hence this post.

Note: Some of the crap (lint looking material) is caused by me trying to remove the tape residue from the print...only made matters worse lol.

 

Thanks Mark for the response.
Comments to your responses:

(1) The tape doesn't just stick, I mean I really don't mind replacing tape each time I do a Print. My problem is the surface of the tape (non adhesive side) is embedded in the print...and due to the LCD panel I was doing - this ends up being the front on the case, very visible. I tried Alcohol 99%, warm water, goo gone (against my better judgement). Nothing. Using the glass by itself doesn't work, heated or not, and vinyl worked but is tough to replace on the bed when it gets marked up (sticking too much as well).

(2a) Sorry didn't photograph the bottom layer. I guess this could be an initial z height issue...
(2b) I was checking every 5 degrees for changes, I started getting better prints at the higher temp, but might be linked to the z height if that is contributing.
(2c) I've never changed the speed settings, they've always stayed at the default 1.0 so I guess I could reduce to 75% or more to see. Are the quoted amounts rates or percentages of full speed?? I'm not sure in Matter Control where the speed is set other than the extrusion and movement rate modifier (in advanced printer settings). I'll look around.

(3) When I say stringing, I mean not strands being carried around, but the filament appears not to fuse to the adjacent layers/filament. so I can run my finger on the edge and easily pop a run of the filament from the printed item. Not sure if I'm explaining this correctly. I would assume that higher temperature would soften the filament more and take a tiny bit more time to cool, therefore it would mix more easily with adjacent layers... no more strands? no?

I really appreciate the guidance, I'll try some manual feeding (by software) in the center and see how it behaves.

 

If you can get it locally I would try Aquanet Super Hold hairspray. It dissolves in water or ethanol. Heat to 60C to dry and print at around 50C. Another one to try is UHU gluestick. I never bothered with any type of tape.

What do you have the fan max speed set to? If it is too high it can cause delamination. You probably don't need the fan for that type of print.

 

Interesting, I'm going to try both Hairspray and Glue Stick this weekend.

The fan hasn't been set to a specific speed, like most of my settings it's left at default I think which is
Auto Fan speed. Off for the first couple layers. I thought this might be related to the issues I was having with the print seemingly messing up always on the 3rd layer, and would recover in a layer or two to complete normally.

Thanks, will give it a go.

Everyone is so helpful on this site, I do appreciate the time to offer the advice to me.

 

See if there is a max fan setting that the auto mode will scale from. I'm not sure that this exists in Mattercontrol. I use a shirt sized gift box cover with a cutout to mask the hairspray and keep in on the bed and away from the carriage and rods. There are some threads on how to use glue stick. Hairspray is pretty easy. It just takes some work to remove a print with a large surface area. Let the bed cool and if it does not pop off I sometimes dribble some water around the edge of the print. If the surface is clean after removal then just give it a light spray to reuse.


Many of us are helping because we have been helped so much by others here.

 

If using hairspray, it's good to clean the bed and give it a good spray. It will be invisible to the eye but the Filene sticks good. And when you take your print off, it's so shiny underneath.

I tried the glue stick but found that it's messy and after a few coats, it leaves a thick mess and might affect the height of the print at some places.

The hairspray I use is the following found in Canada




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

I've been messing around with Fan ON / OFF / AUTO and 0-255, masking tape with/without glue stick, heated/not heated bed. I either run into the not sticking issue or the sticking too much issue lol, one way or the other...never the in between.

I been trying to print the bottom half of Graphic LCD, I tried prying it off but the strength of the slice to slice isn't that strong and it easily cracks. The last time using tape and glue stick, I could have easily picked the printer up (if the part have that strength) by the part stuck to the bed. Finally I used alcohol on the print and it became gummy and released.

I really feel like I'm still not getting the 'print' correct. I 'll get a layer or two fine and then a little glob of filament will end up on the print, then the head will drag it across damaging other areas...etc. You get the idea.

I wish someone could show a video that clearly shows what the first layer should look like and how the print should normally progress. I'm a bit frustrated, especially due to the 2 hours between failures. Gets a little 'difficult' to handle.

Thanks, I'll try and find the Alberto....shouldn't be an issue. And I'll make a cardboard shield for spraying the bed.

I see how this all turn out. Right now 80% of the prints look great, except hear and there are issues, the layers don't bond really well so it just seems like weak layers of filament (in thin walls - flat surfaces look fine).

Chris

 

Chris,
I'm not sure how much experimenting you did with temperature but it you should be doing some small solid test cubes and hollow frames to get to the right temperature for layer to layer adhesion. Print and try to pull apart with pliers. Also, did you try another filament spool?

There are many many good postings on the first layer from Tesseract. Sometimes I tweak it while skirt loops are being printed by turning the left and right threaded Z rods slightly (clockwise for higher, counterclockwise for lower). Too high and the filament won't stick. Too low and it's so squished that plastic oozes to the side to each pass and builds up. Some buildup is OK because it is usually covered and cleaned up by the second layer. This is really not too hard if your bed is reasonably level in the Y direction.

Get Aquanet Extra Hold (or Alberto) and use water or alcohol to unstick large contact area prints.

 

Actually I've never done that. Sooo, maybe you can recommend a test object which might fit the bill for testing the layer to layer adhesion. Also, I think I remember seeing a block object that had temperatures written on them that allowed you to see the differences caused by temp - maybe I'll see if I can find that.

I only picked up 2 rolls of filament, one Red (looks like orange) PLA and one Black ABS...and everyone seems to think stick with PLA until you can get it right before venturing off into anything else. Maybe I'll pick up another roll of PLA in Blue or Black.

-edit-
Maybe something like this:
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:210111/#files

 

I've got simplify 3d so I'll generate the gcode to do that print on the robo.

 

Ok I ended up doing this item: http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:211514

The original had issues and was printing way off the bed, so I noticed this one stated it was a fixed version (even though it was tempest2 and the earlier one was called tempest 3). My results (I changed the temp every 10mm manually on MatterControl) to me are inconclusive. I'm still lost, this was NO BED HEAT, and NO FAN on extruder.

I will try breaking it at each of the temp centers to see if there is any difference in adherence.

BTW - the UHU glue stick worked (no masking tape), and it was only moderately difficult to get off the bed.

Now I have noticed that some people have web'ed surface around base of objects (lack of the proper term) stand or something to help the print stick. What is that? and is it possible to do through MatterControl because I haven't seen it.

There was issues with some of the layers dragging into the center of the column Check last photo, Sorry tough to photograph with my phone (not enough light).

 

Considered that software for purchase - is it worth the cost?

 

I will check for the thread, yes I'm cross posting on my own topic, stupid me.

Checked around, there is only an option for 'Generate Support Material' (in Slic3r) it doesn't generate a raft, only support in openings from what I can tell. I'll retest it.

Thanks again.

 

I think a raft for PLA is overkill for most prints. With Aquanet hairspray and a 50C bed PLA will stick fine (110C for ABS). It you have a thin edged, low first layer surface area model I would specify a 3mm brim in Slic3r. A raft may be useful for some ABS models.

 

I'm soooo stupid I didn't notice the 'SHOW ALL SETTINGS' box in MatterControl, so all I saw was 'Generate Support Material' with no other options. If I check the Show All I get a substantial amount of tweekable settings including the RAFT Layers. Even lets me change movement speeds, extrusion speed, etc. Now I feel like I have a tiny bit more control.

 

Yep, totally understand. In fact I can hardly say getting PLA to stick is my problem. Getting it to release, well yes, although the glue stick does seem to work so far, and it's easy to clean up with water...so far so good. I did buy the E3D hot end with the intention to swap out, but currently I haven't earned it lol. It will stay on the shelf for a little while until I get everything figured out.