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[How To] Dual Bowden E3D v5 on the RoBo 3D

Discussion in 'Mods and Upgrades' started by Mike Kelly, Mar 31, 2014.

  1. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    NOTICE: THIS THREAD IS OUT OF DATE AND ONLY IS DESIGNED TO WORK WITH THE E3D v5, NOT THE NEWER V6. CHECK THIS THINGIVERSE PAGE FOR UPDATED DESIGNS:


    http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:681916


    [​IMG]

    Click for Thingiverse
    What is this?:
    Converts the stock RoBo 3D printer with a single direct feed extruder and replaces it with dual bowden extruder with no loss in x travel. This is just the x-carriage as the cold end will be released separately

    [​IMG]

    Background:

    I have designed and fabricated, with the help of tessarect, a dual extruder upgrade to the RoBo 3D printer.

    As many RoBo 3D owners make the upgrade to a E3D all metal hot end, it makes sense that instead of going from stock hot end to kraken, many users will want to go stock hot end > single E3D > dual E3D to save cost on parts.

    Note:
    With that in mind this mod is directed at the latter group of people. If you are on the stock robo 3d hot end and want to upgrade to multi-extruders, I HIGHLY recommend not doing this mod but rather wait for me to release the kraken version. The kraken is smaller, lighter weight, easier to adjust, and provides more options later on. This mod is just inteded for people with an existing E3D looking to add a second.

    BOM:

    Printed:
    • 1x X carriage
    • 1x Fan Shroud
    • 1x Flow Director
    • 1x Fan Holder
    • 2x J-Head Saddle
    • 2x J-Head Mount
    Hardware:
    Build Instructions

    Note: Animations may show the E3D as being fully assembled. Please check instructions to verify when to fully assemble the E3D as it will increase build complexity to have it fully assembled from the start

    Phase 1: Remove original X-Carriage

    Watch the original install video to understand how to properly assemble/disassemble the x axis


    Phase 2: Build Dual X-Carriage

    Step 1: Assemble J-head mount

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    During this step you'll only be using the bowden heatsink from the E3D. Attach the J-head mount and saddle around the heatsink. Press in the 2 M3 nuts in the open slots, this may require a tool to get them fully seated. Once the nuts are in position use 2x M3-25mm screws to secure the saddle to the mount.



    Step 2: Securing the E3D

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    The x carriage is designed to allow the E3D heatsinks to pass through from the top. The height is controlled by two screw/nut/spring combos per side. Only one side needs the spring, though it doesn't hurt to have both sides spring controlled

    The principle behind this is by tightening/loosening one dual extruder plate you'll be able to lower/raise the nozzle height respectively. You should only need to adjust a small fraction of a mm but this gives you that option.

    Cut away view of height control:
    [​IMG]

    The order goes:
    • Push in the M4 nut
    • Screw in the M4-25mm to create a post, ensure on one side the part fan holder is in place depending on if you want it front or rear facing
    • Place the spring into the housing
    • Insert E3D and j-head plate over assemble
    • Secure almost fully tight using the M4 Lock nut
    Step 3: Push in bearings

    You'll need to push the bearings into the holder. I used a bearing press but you could use a vise. ABS is recommended to help prevent splitting.

    Step 4: Install x end stop screw.

    Remove from the stock assemble and install in the new one.

    Step 5: Assemble Fan Shroud
    [​IMG]

    Ideally you'll want to install your fans in the shroud before installing it on the E3D heatsink. You should only do 3 screws on the outer sides of the fan as it can be difficult to remove the middle ones later. Run the fan wires towards the middle and through the front hole in the case

    Step 6: Finish assembly of E3D

    The E3D can now be assembled. The heater cartridges can be fed through the hole in the plate from either direction.

    Step 7: Assemble Parts fan

    [​IMG]

    You'll need 4 16mm m3 screws for this. I had to cut 2 of mine down to fit, but since it's self threading it's not a big deal to do. The parts fan and airflow director will need to be tight against the backing otherwise there will be potential for interference with the print.

    Phase 3:

    With the X carriage now assembled you'll need to install it as if you were installing the stock x-carriage.

    I will follow up later with how to calibrate this nozzle. For now please let me know if there's any other steps needed.

    You can view my entire build photo log here: https://cloudup.com/cGGfhsMgMnd

    Click Here to Download!


    -Mike
     
    #1 Mike Kelly, Mar 31, 2014
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2015
    18 people like this.
  2. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    Awesome work!!!
     
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  3. tesseract

    tesseract Moderator
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    Great job I need to do this on mine ......oh wait. lol I love your tutorial on this it is amazing. Everyone now has no excuse for not upgrading
     
  4. Printed Solid

    Printed Solid Volunteer Admin
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    I actually stocked up on e3d bowdens just for people who want to do this upgrade.
     
  5. AxisLab

    AxisLab Well-Known Member

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    Thanks so much for adding the point of if you are still on stock, this is the longer route so to speak.
    I had been putting the idea together since you posted it on the Facebook owners page, and being on a stock robo myself, that was good to know.
    Besides for that, holy cow, nice work and great walk through and presentation. This is awesome.
     
  6. Michael DiFilippo

    Michael DiFilippo Active Member

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    Great work Mike!
     
  7. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    Thanks everyone. It's kinda cool running 2 E3D's but in hindsight I wish I had just gone with the kraken. Even if you're just running 2 of the 4 nozzles the calibration is much better and you gain more z travel. Granted you get to deal with water but they include the pump you need.

    I'm debating if I should make a carriage akin to stock for the kraken, or use jeff's super carriage for it.
     
  8. SoLongSidekick

    SoLongSidekick Active Member

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    The awesome thing about this (everything) is the incredibly instructions and presentation; nice work Mike. I have almost two complete E3D's so I am debating whether to go this route or get a kraken. It would definitely be more expensive to go the kraken route but would offer a bit more versatility.

    Started picking up the vitamins for this anyways :-D. Gonna start printing the parts in the next few days. Thanks a ton Mike.
     
    3 people like this.
  9. Mattchu

    Mattchu Member

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    for the kraken I'd keep it as minimalist as possible for a carriage. And then go Dual Kraken (have different nozzles as well as multiple filaments). :p

    Clearly, I'm an overachiever. While I'm not running dual bowden (yet) I'm running a single bowden that Jeff has provided mucho useful advice on. I'll have to post pictures of the hideous brown rig I'm using :p
     
  10. multimake

    multimake New Member

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    Hi Mike, great job, thanks for sharing!
    I am ready to try your model.
    I need to buy the bowden hotends, can I use hexagon with your design?

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    I see no reason you couldn't use Hexagons. I finally got it modeled in and can verify fitment later.

    Because the hexagon takes up so much less space I was thinking of designing a new x carriage with less width to use for the hexagons. Then you can have a larger X travel.
     
  12. Brandon Quimson

    Brandon Quimson New Member

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    Ok Thanks Mike
     
  13. Galaxius

    Galaxius Well-Known Member

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    Anything new to report for a dual hexagon carriage?

    Has anyone tested Mike's carriage with dual hexagons?
     
    #13 Galaxius, Nov 13, 2014
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 13, 2014
  14. Brandon Quimson

    Brandon Quimson New Member

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    I did it with two E3Dv6
     
  15. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    Yes and no respectively.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    I have the parts printed but haven't tested it yet. Lemme know if you want to help!

    I'm thinking it's possible to fit 2 25mm fans without losing X travel, but that requires some testing to be sure 25mm fans are sized right.
     
    2 people like this.
  16. Galaxius

    Galaxius Well-Known Member

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    @Mike Kelly, I'm currently in the process of building Tony's y axis upgrade and then have to print more Christmas decorations for my wife
    I also only have one hexagon at the moment and am not yet running Bowden. But I'll help where I can lol. I'll have to do a Bowden upgrade once I get the y axis done and upgrade to metric threaded rods, I have the rods just haven't had the time and my prints are pretty good with the stock imperial rods.

    Regarding dual 25mm fans. Wouldn't a single 40mm provide higher air flow? Also the fewer fans the less points of failure.

    I might have to get your cad file so I can design front and rear ducts for the print cooling fans instead of the unducted brackets. It looks like I could make use of the mounting holes on the front and back of the carriage.

    I wish solid works was cheaper for tinkerers.
     
  17. Mike Kelly

    Mike Kelly Volunteer

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    In principle, yes. Though most 40mm fans that are quiet only have like 4cfm. The 25mm's I have are rated at 1.8cfm. So you get a bit more with a single 40mm fan and it's quieter, but it's impossible to fit it in my carriage design without losing X travel. I try and avoid that.

    Yeah I don't print PLA much at all so that's not a concern of mine. I have the fan duct without wings as well so you can use that if you like. I run with the stock enclosure and try and make sure it doesn't lose Z travel when it hits the enclosure, so I'm careful to stay within the bounds.

    Solidworks is a great professional tool and I'm glad they allow 2 installs for "work from home" use :)
     
  18. Galaxius

    Galaxius Well-Known Member

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    I'm keen to give a better x carriage a crack. I like Donhuevo's design too. I use the bed heated for PLA so ducted cooling works better, and it's better for bridging etc as you know. I have a few spools of ABS that I haven't been game to try yet, still learning and upgrading with PLA. It's a never ending cycle of learn and upgrade. I think the printer is controlling me sometimes to upgrade itself lol.

    I'll have to investigate educational pricing for Solidworks some day I think.
     
    2 people like this.
  19. wthierry

    wthierry Active Member

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    I printed the main carriage on the robo, however the holes for the bearings were a little too tight. did you have to bore them out with something?
     
  20. Skaltec

    Skaltec New Member

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    Mike,

    Great design I printed and assembled it just fine, but decided to upgrade my carriage to 10mm rods and bearings. Has anyone bored this out for LM10UU's Might get a little thin removing another 2mm. I am extending all axis's so maybe I will just scale the entire thing up.

    -Matt
     

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