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Answered Robo3D R1 multiple issues

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by Sorin Mihai, Apr 26, 2018.

  1. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    It is hard to be precise with that error. It is potentially due to a number of things all related to the thermistor. Even if you rule out the firmware -- The thermistor itself, bad connection somewhere in-line, bad RAMPS or bad Arduino. Usually it is the thermistor or the wiring/connections.
     
  2. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    That was my initial thought, but know is too late to go back cus I don't even have the first firmware. Anyway, only by persisting I can solve issues. The bed temp issue I think is sorted, meaning is the bed temp sensor the faulty one. I say that because in the last attempts to do anything (I tried to do a bed PID again and other quick tasks) the bed temp was -15. That means that is faulty. I tried to check if is in the right position, to hold it in my hand, (pointless attempts, but for the love of art.....), nothing, continuously showing -15. I have to order a new one to be 100% sure that is the sensor. Can someone tell me what model is this sensor? I think is a 100K NTC 3950 thermistor.
     
  3. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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  4. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    The bed thermistor is EPCOS 100k

    Use whatever you want and edit the CONFIGURATION.H to reflect the exact one you get.
    Most any 100k NTC thermistor can work. Look at the values in that header file.
     
  5. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Thank you! I took it out to check it and is working, meaning that with the thermistor connected on my multimeter, if I take it in the fridge the value is near 100K with the thermistor in my hand is around 74K, and near the heated hotend goes in the order of 100s ohms. So I have to dig in..... I started to like this printer, it challenges me! I'll give you feedback as soon as my new thermistor will arrive.
    Until then, can you help with 2 issues?
    1 -that "warping" of the infill print as is described a few post before this, why is the nozzle collecting material from nearby?
    2 -if you will have to choose, what type of vertical rods/leadscrews will you choose for printing functional prototypes/components?

    Thank you!
     
  6. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    That is possibly the material being put down too hot. Usually when you extrude hot the plastic wants to stick to the hot nozzle. However it is probably never as simple as one thing. Calibrate the extruder for start to make sure you are not over extruding (see linked video below)

    Probably I would go with integrated leadscrews/steppers. They eliminate wobble from using a coupler to join the stepper and the threaded rod. The threading is not hugely important, the length is your limit. Something like this in the correct length (this is just an example, I did not check the length):

    https://smile.amazon.com/Redrex-Integrated-Stepper-Printer-Routers/dp/B01DVD87Q6

    Those are a little steep on the thread (8mm) so look around and see what you can find. They would still work once you adjust the Z steps in the firmware to match. As always, use the reprap calculator to determine what Z steps you need for whatever you get:

    https://www.prusaprinters.org/calculator/
     
  7. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Thanks Mark, can you put that link for the video with "warping"? I can't see it! I did a small test, I've changed the 2 thermistors on the Ramps, bed with thermistor from hotend and hotend with thermistor in my hand......... preheated the hotend and checked the temp for bed in MC..... is working ok (was a short test max 10 s), and for the free thermistor I was checking the temp for cold metal and the charger of my laptop, was working as well. Hmmmm! The new thermistor will give me a final ideea on what is happening, I hope is not the Ramps or the Mega 2560 board.
     
  8. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    I forgot it :)

     
  9. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Thanks Mark, I did had my extruder extruding 110mm instead of 100. Fix it. Great video, really appreciated!
     
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  10. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Hi Mark, for autobed levelling, do I still need the old Z switch or I should cancel it and keep only the 2 new ones?
     
  11. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    You can remove it if you add the two new ones. I just reused it (removed it and reinstalled it as one of the ones on the crossbar) as one of the new Z sensors when I redid mine, but either way.
     
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  12. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Hi Mark,
    Just finish the upgrade for bed auto-levelling, works ok, looks ok. In firmware I am keeping the
    #define Z_MIN_PROBE_USES_Z_MIN_ENDSTOP_PIN
    and
    #define FIX_MOUNTED_PROBE //--BH
    with
    #define AUTO_BED_LEVELING_BILINEAR //--BH
    Is this ok?
    I have run a G29, then a M851 Z1.6 and printed a small test. Then I lowered the Z to 1.5 and the nozzle didn't lowered properly, prob from 4mm it lowered 1 or 2 mm max aldo first time did it . I am doing something wrong for sure. Do I have to do a manually probing first? Do I have to save the results? I am lost know and can't understand why is not consistent in lowering the nozzle after G29 at the beginning of the print!
    Second, do you know which is the pin 1 from AUX 3 on Ramps? I bought a smart display controller and the seller didn't sent the smart adapter so I have to improvise and do connections manually, all good just that on may Ramps board on AUX 3 they didn't marked the pin 1 or something else. I am wiring after the below schematic.
    Thank you![​IMG]
     
  13. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    If you are using the stock firmware you only need to use the M565 to set the autoleveling Z offset.

    Here is my startup GCode:

    G28 ; home all axes
    G1 Z5 F5000 ; lift Z by 5mm
    M565 Z-0.6 ; set the offset for auto-leveling mechanism
    G29 ; run auto-level

    I'd suggest you start at M565 Z-1.0 and adjust from there.

    If you are on something other than the stock firmware (stock is marlin 1.0 there are some 1.1 versions out there that users have provided) I can't help you. I don't use it. refer to the threads on that version posted here and see if someone who is using it can chime in.

    Here is the RAMPS 1.4 connections:

    ramps1-4connectors.png
     
  14. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Note that the PIN 1 on Aux 3 is reversed from the others...
     
  15. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    I am using 1.1.4 for the moment. But I,'ll try with seting the Z offset before G29.

    Thank you !
     
  16. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    You can't With 1.1 the M565 is deprecated. It is an entirely different process.
    It is also not a process I am familiar with, but others like @WheresWaldo might be able to add some value
     
  17. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Hi Mark, sorry for the silence, I've been preparing for some exams. Today I had some time to work more on the Robo and I modified the Marlin 1.1.8 for my printer.
    First try was with Mesh levelling. Followed all instruction from Marlin site. During the print I could see that the mesh is working and Z is adjusted during the same layer. The only issue was with having a constant Z offset. I was trying the same model to print, and each time I had a different Z at the start of the print. And it was visible that is a different Z, sometimes smaller then the layer thickness, sometimes much higher.
    Then I tried the UBL. Good impression, it works during the print. Again I have the same issue with having the same Z offset each print. Sometimes it scratches the tape, sometimes is at 0.8 above the bed. And I am not changing the Z offset in all this time. More than that, aldo I am manually adjusting the Z offset during the first layer, and the filament is pushed on the bed, at other the beginning of other layers (not all of them) I can see that the filament is dropped on the model not pushed so I decrease the Z again. A good part is that with Merlin 118, I don't have that ugly sound from Z axis that I was mentioning at the beginning of the thread.
    Now comes the biggest concern: I am printing with 3 counts on the inside and outside perimeters. When I have round perimeters, like holes, the first count is not sticking properly on round edges and the other 2 counts are ok. And that is not happening at every layer. I will attach images.
    I think that i am not setting something right.
    So I am printing at a speed of 50 mm/s and first layer 50% speed and 0.9 extrusion. Temp 210/60 for the first layer and after 200/50. My G-code
    Code:
    G28 X0 Y0 Z0 ; home all axes
    G1 Z2 F5000 ; lift nozzle
    M109 S[temperature] ; set the extruder temp and wait
    G28 X0 Y0 Z0 ; Home Z again in case there was filament on nozzle
    M851 Z0.5;
    M420 S1;
    
    My nozzle is 0.4mm
    I don't know how to solve the doggy Z-offset, how to keep it constant.
    Now a few questions:
    1. is my speed too high? (I am printing only PLA for the moment)
    2. what acceleration should I have? Curently I have
    DEFAULT_MAX_ACCELERATION { 9000, 9000, 100, 10000 }
    #define DEFAULT_ACCELERATION 1300 // X, Y, Z and E acceleration for printing moves
    #define DEFAULT_RETRACT_ACCELERATION 3000 // E acceleration for retracts
    #define DEFAULT_TRAVEL_ACCELERATION 3000
    3. Jerk values are ok? I have
    #define DEFAULT_XJERK 10.0
    #define DEFAULT_YJERK 10.0
    #define DEFAULT_ZJERK 0.3
    #define DEFAULT_EJERK 5.0
    4. I had an interesting episode, for 5 times in a row, I was trying to print the same part and at layer 3, the hotend temp was dropping with 10 for a short time and when it was increasing back to 200 I was getting a Thermal Runway error. Should I modify the values from Thermal Protection Period or Thermal Protection Hysteresis? I have 40 and 4.
    5. For my Z offset issue, could it be the stepper driver?
    Thank you for your patience!
    1.jpg 6.jpg 2.jpg 3.jpg 4.jpg 5.jpg
     
  18. mark tomlinson

    mark tomlinson ༼ つ ◕_ ◕ ༽つ
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    Well, again I can't address you Marlin issues/settings since you are on a much later version than I use. Someone else using that version can speak up (I think @WheresWaldo is on a 1.1.x release, there are a number of folks). For the R1/R1+ I don't use MESH or UBL since they don't even have 1.1.x installed. The C2 I just manually leveled. Was quick and easy given the size of the bed and I removed all autoleveling from the GCode scripts.

    PLA can be done at the default speeds on most slicers. Slow down the print speed for a test and see if it improves things. Frankly given the subtle problems you show I'd try another slicer first.

    On the printer we do fine detail work with I have the Marlin acceleration numbers divided by 4.
    The others I have it divided by 3. The default numbers in there are ... silly. Except for the extruder and Z numbers those are fine. The GregsWade simply can't accelerate as fast as that so the number is (largely) meaningless.

    Does that mean it will print slower? Yep. But far more accurately. If you want to maximize the speed vs. quality you will need to spend some time tweakings/testing the accel. numbers.

    Same thing. Too high (except for Z and E).

    The temperature dropping is usually the parts fan getting air on the nozzle and making it vary. My solution is to go with a better heater core :) They are cheap (a few dollars from Amazon) and easy to swap. The Hexagon (stock) comes with a 30w core, the E3D comes with a 25w core (silly really) and the ones I use are ceramic 40w cores. They get to temperature quicker and hold it better.

    Sometimes on some models of printers (R1 mostly, not R1+) the thermistor would get loose in the rubber boot and move a bit which caused temperatures to vary and will cause grief.


    Sure, that is possible, but more likely an issue with the later version of Marlin and/or the configuration of the leveling.
     
    #38 mark tomlinson, May 11, 2018
    Last edited: May 11, 2018
  19. WheresWaldo

    WheresWaldo Volunteer ( ͠° ͟ʖ ͡°)
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    I haven't read the entire thread but based on your latest posts, I would lower some of the settings for Acceleration. I have not found anything over 1000 for max and default to work well on the R1 hardware. Part of the issue with changing offsets is the implementation of the Z Probe. The idea was genious, make the nozzle the probe, the implementation is not, there are a lot of variables and the X axis tends to teeter on the nozzle and the switches on either side do not trigger in the same location. This makes settings for auto-level a bit less than reliable. In the Community Firmware posted here the home position was changed to a corner instead of the middle to help minimize the effect of build surface bowing and provide a more consistent home position. Also there is a mechanical limit with how fine a move the stepper can make, depending on you leadscrew or threaded rod used for Z. The Prusa calculator can help you decide what the absolute minimum movement is. Please note that this is very important since Steppers cannot do fractional steps and that microsteps used by RAMPS boards are electrically driven and there is no guarantee that microsteps are 100% accurate, we just assume they are close enough.
     
  20. Sorin Mihai

    Sorin Mihai New Member

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    Thanks guys, I am using Slic3r for the moment with MC. I have the option to go for CuraEngine or MatterSlice. Are any of these good and how can I increase the list with slicers?
    I am reducing the accel to 800 default and 1000 maxim. I will reduce the speed to 40mm/s as well. Jerk for X and Y will be 5.
     

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